Julia Jacklin's Just Trying Not to Write Shit Songs

Last October, Sydney-based and Blue Mountains born Julia Jacklin released Don't Let the Kids Win. It's a hell of a record. Mysterious but revealing. Sweet but adult. Consistent, fun, earnest. And perhaps most importantly: very fucking playable.

At 26, this is Jacklin's first foray into the world of fully-formed releases. On a painfully hot day in Melbourne, we sat down over very cold waters to talk about Good Charlotte, staying original, and trying not to write shit songs.

So. Basically your record is extremely good.
Thank you.

I missed the boat, I only started giving it a whirl like, two months ago.
It's good to know people are still listening to it.

Haha. I heard "Pool Party" first. I was really drawn in by the tone and the story and the way you communicated things. And being an occassionally heterosexual woman I related. It seems pretty autobiographical to me, is it hard to write about people like that without opening up old wounds? Or without opening up communication channels that aren't necessarily welcome?
I think so far I've kept it pretty safe. That song in particular, the person it's about doesn't know it's about them. And I don't think they ever will. I hope. Because I covered it in enough fiction that I think I hid it pretty well. I guess, I think it's important to be honest and I do want to talk about my relationships but I don't want to drag anyone over hot coals. So there's a real fine balance between being honest and being an arsehole.

Absolutely.
I think so far I've done okay. But we'll see.

We will see. If anyone @s you on Twitter I'll know to do a follow up interview.
Exactly.

I'm noticing, in the music coming out of Australia that is finding success, a very common thread and that is brutally honest, self-deprecating lyricism. It's getting interesting. I love it.
I agree.

It seems like artists are being more re-inventive and genre-spanning at the moment, too. Making artistic changes from record to record. Do you see yourself playing with your sound on the next record?
Right now I guess I'm trying not to think like that just yet. Because I'm so fresh to the whole thing, I just want to be releasing music that I'm writing that's good, and not getting too caught up in anything else. I think that can sometimes happen when you make a record and it does well and you're like "well I've got all these resources now, so I might as well chuck all this shit onto it. Or maybe I'll get a white suit and play a character." I don't know. That's probably a bit further down the road.

Sounds fun to me.
Ha, yeah. For now I just want to concentrate on making sure the songs aren't shit. Instead of making bland music with lots of fancy instruments on it or something.

I read on your Wikipedia that your high school band covered Evanescence and Avril Lavigne. Which was impressive.
Yeah that was a pretty big adventure.

What did you listen to as a teenager?
Well when I was in that band, Anonymous, I was about thirteen? In year seven. And I think that's such an interesting time of your life in terms of music, because it's this massive crossover time. I was still listening to the music my parents listened to, and was obsessed with Doris Day musicals and Ella Fitzgerald. And on my Dad's side, Deep Purple and what not. But then I was also obsessed with the pop world—Britney Spears and Avril Lavigne, even though I thought at the time she was a genuine punk. Thinking Good Charlotte was the coolest rock band in the world. But a big moment for me was when Radiohead came in, when I was 12, and I heard "Idioteque" at my neighbour's house and I was like, "oof, what is that?" I just remember it being a very defining moment, where it cut through all the other stuff. And I thought, "I'm listening to this with my own ears. Nobody's telling me it's good. Nobody's telling me to listen to it. I just like it purely because I like it." And I started to listen to more bands like that.

Man, that's great. I was in love with Good Charlotte as a kid. I went to their show at Festival Hall, it was the first show I went to alone, with friends. I came home and got my sister to draw a "Good Charlotte" tattoo, in their Ye Olde font, on my lower back.
You should've gotten it!

I know. I actually think I should have. Because it's like, fourteen years later now and I think that probably all the way up until now it would've been horrible, but I think now it would be really funny and great.
Yeah. I think a few years ago it would've been really bad. Like when they were judges on The Voice and on those KFC ads. But now, while we're having this real nostalgia moment, it would've gone down well.

I agree. So what are you listening to now?
I'm listening to a lot of Mitski.

I don't know what that is!
She's from America. She's half Japanese and she's kind of lived all over the world. Her music is something I haven't really heard before, in a really incredible way. Maybe if I was more into 90s rock I'd see more references but for me it mixes that beautiful honesty, thoughtful lyrics—not like, thrown to the wind like "oh that'll work, I'll just add some metaphor about a river"—with fuzzy guitars and it cuts through to me. I haven't felt that inspired in a long time.

Wow. That's dope. I don't make music but I always worry that if I did, I would listen to something and then immediately go and make that record.
Yeah, totally.

And people would be like, "sorry… This exists."
I definitely did that in the past, and I've definitely had comparisons made between my record and other people's. Which is totally fair. So I think you're never going to shake that completely, but if you have your wits about you you'll be alright. It's easy to copy stuff in the beginning but once you start developing your own voice, it's a bit easier to take bits here and there, and not just buy the exact same guitar as someone and write on the same topics. We'll see, my next record might be a total rip off.

It's just The Coloring Book by Chance The Rapper.
Haha, yeah exactly.

So how long did it take you to write Don't Let the Kids Win ?
I think that was about two years. The first song I wrote from the record was "Coming of Age," and the last one was "Don't Let the Kids Win." To me, in my head, I see it as a five year process. I wrote a lot of shit for three years. And then those songs were the best of probably 100 songs that I played at open mic nights and tossed out the next day when nobody clapped. It was kind of a long process but I think everyone's first record is because it's just an accumulation of everything you've done up until that point.

And how are you going to change that process now that you've got a record out?
I'm playing new songs in the set now. Which is funny. I feel like when I went and saw bands when I was younger and they said "Now we're going to play a new song" I'd be like "noooo." Now I'm all for it but when I was younger I was like "Play the hits!" And also there's this whole thing about holding your material close to you and don't give anything away. But I just don't know how that process would work. For me to know it's a good song I have to play it to people. Not that I need their approval, but I need to know that I feel good playing it in front of people, that I feel good saying those words. So I'm just chucking them in the set now and if they're shit then… I just won't play 'em again.

Sell 'em to Rihanna.
Yep. Just like Ed Sheeran.

Exactly. So, saved the most annoying question for last: If you could have written one song, would it be?
This changes a lot. But my go-to answer for that would have to be Leonard Cohen's "Suzanne."

You are not the first person who's answered that question with that song!
I think it's just like, the best song in history.

It's extremely good.
It's the perfect song! It's the melody, the lyrics. The way he returns to the refrain but changes the lyrics slightly each time. I try not to listen to that song too often because I never want to get sick of it. It's like a drug that I just partake in every six months.

You're like a recovering addict.
Totally! Leave it for a while and then get my fix again. That's the sweetest thing I've ever heard…

Listen to Don't Let the Kids Win below. And see tour dates here.

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